Both are at 3-A. Xehanort obviously is in his X-Blade/True Kingdom Hearts Key while Mundus will be in his Beasthead Alternate Timeline Key. This can be a battle for the 5th most powerful 3-A since Kingdom Hearts got A LOT of revisions applied to it on the last thread.
Oliver de jesus wrote:
>Does not resist bfr and diseases ...
How long does your EA restore? And how good is your resistance to mind hax?
Xehanort already has dimensional travel and low multiversal range, they just weren't applied to his profile yet. Mundus' Disease Manip doesn't work on Non Corporeals from what I've been told, and Xehanort as that while as a heart. Explain what you mean by EA restore. His Mind Manip resistance is on a conceptual scale as he can resist the corruption of darkness and RoD, which attack the heart. The heart contains the emotions of one's being as well, and darkness has shown to entirely corrupt emotions too.
Fodder enemies in KH have NEP, and Xehanort can interact/erase them with his attacks, so Mundus' NEP doesn't help with him. Oneshot gets countered by conceptual regen. Xehanort leads with universal scale Conceptual Manip, and I don't see Mundus having an answer for passive Info Absorption which creates a duplicate of the enemy, all with the same hax, skills, AP, etc. Xehanort takes this.
Each hit from the Keyblade is negging his immortality and regen on a conceptual scale, along with a massive variety of spells Mundus cannot resist. Mundus also has no solid way of putting down Xehanort, and even if he could, he could just restart the fight from the very beginning. Not to mention that Xehanort can also bring out hordes of Heartless at his disposal, all that have Death Manipulation and EE that are borderline passive, and Mundas not having a way to put them down either.
All and all, I think this is a stomp. Xehanort has too much hax, too many summons, and versatilty for Mundus to handle.
Oliver de jesus wrote:
If I were not so vague void mundus / argosax I had conceptual since they control / embody the energy that created the entire universe.
<s>Now that I think about it, the mundus base shouldn't have conceptual resistance since I fight Sparda? same that is known to eliminate names (as arkham explains it and through some ancient writings to highlight a random demon knew that) why fight, if you can simply say: "mundus because it does not turn you into anything" and so do it with argosax? and death hax doesn't work on beings with NEP if it doesn't have feats.
Mundus doesn't have that listed on his profile and you don't get resistance to something just because you can fight someone, not unless the dude used that ability and it didn't work.
Heartless abilities work on conceptual aspects of your being. Conceptual hax > Type 1 NEP just to clarify.
It's scaled from Vanitas who could regenerate from conceptual destruction. The page notes that he regenerated even though his heart had been destroyed, which means his soul, mind, and body would be destroyed and he could still Regen.
>It's scaled from Vanitas who could regenerate from his thoughts and feelings. The page notes that he regenerated even though his heart had been destroyed, which means his soul, mind, and body would be destroyed and he could still Regen.
That's Low-Godly tho:
"Low-Godly: The ability to regenerate from the complete physical destruction of your body, instead restoring it from your disembodied consciousness, whether that be your soul, mind, some other nonphysical aspect of yourself, esoteric or metaphysical energy, or something else."
While Mid-Godly is being completly erased with nothing of you existing yet coming back
Take note I mentioned his heart being destroyed. You could conceptually destroy the idea of Vanitas and he was still able to regenerate back from it. Xehanort got his abilities after he merged with all of his vessels in Scala Ad Caelum, meaning he would scale to this Regeneration. I should've clarified that earlier.
Xehanort's Regeneration is more potent than both of those options, but it doesn't qualify for anything except Mid-Godly atm. It would be High-Godly though if those revisions go through about Conceptual Erasure Regen.
He never would've had a place to have to use it against Sora. He was physically stronger and even by the end of the fight, he wasn't even bruised, just worn out from their battle. We agreed in the past CRT to apply the natural abilities of True Organization members to Xehanort. He self-imposed his own defeat as well.
They already got Conceptual Manipulation from a different CRT regardless and Antvasima agreed they were all good to add. Xehanort kept the Conceptual Manipulation, but everyone else lost it because it didn't apply to every strike. That's what we agreed on.
"Take note I mentioned his heart being destroyed. You could conceptually destroy the idea of Vanitas and he was still able to regenerate back from it. Xehanort got his abilities after he merged with all of his vessels in Scala Ad Caelum, meaning he would scale to this Regeneration. I should've clarified that earlier."
Uh that doesn't debunk anything. It literally just says that his thoughts and feelings were around like the Lingering Will, it doesn't remotely mentioned he regened from them. Both BBS and KH3 literally state that he ceased to exist when his heart was destroyed, his very concept destroyed.
The thing is, did he get conceptually destroyed? Or "he could be conceptually destroyed"?
One is an assumption, the other one is a feat that can be used.
Also, again, the profile says his thoughts and feelings were still there which means not all of his mind or soul or whatever of him was left, i.e. he didn't got erased conceptually or erased as far as I can tell.
When I said "could be conceptually destroyed," I was referring to the fact that one could do it in a similar manner of what already happened to Vanitas. It was a feat that happened after Vanitas lost in his struggle against Aqua, Mickey, and Ventus. That was based off the old variation of the profile that assumed hearts were just souls which got negged as an idea in KHIII. That probably needs to be removed and Speedster already explained the specificity behind that.
it is worth mentioning that mundus has a soul and mind hax different from the one he resists
destroy = \ = transform
and if I say that they are the same, mundus affects people with resistance to soul and mind hax + info analysis and how good is the time hax that resisted if it is not very good, mundus steps on it
We already went over the Disease Manip being irrelevant since Xehanort can exist/fight as a heart, which is the concept of someone. Nor does he need a mind to exist (he was this [https://www.khwiki.com/Heartless thing as Ansem, which lack a soul, mind, and body), and no mind = you don't have something to comprehend said form in the first place. His Time Manipulation "under certain circumstances" is outright wrong and wasn't changed under his revision. He's unaffected by Time Stop with the Keyblade, and Nomura stated he resisted Mickey's Time Manipulation by having far superior Time Manipulation, and Mickey's Time Manipulation worked on the organization members, who have resistance to Time Manipulation on their profiles.
Also, how does the Spatial Manipulation work? Because Xehanort already has dumb potent Spatial Manipulation of his own through Xigbar.
Disease does nothing to Xehenort and I don't believe Time manipulation would do anything either. He would still be affected by mind stuff since having one but not needing it wouldn't prevent someone from being mind manipulated and what not, just having the mind destroyed or erased.
Spatial manipulation basically fucks reality and causes infinite loops (not time loops, just physical loops on the enviornment) and is essentially a BFR but I don't think it would matter to Xehenort....probably.
The Madness Manip hits him and nothing happens because Xehanort doesn't need a mind to function, that literally gives him an outright immunity to Mundus' Madness Manip. You can't manipulate something someone doesn't need because it won't do anything to them. He'd need to affect Xehanort's heart to do anything mental wise. Also, can some more clarification be given on the Spatial Manip?
@Tony I know that. I was saying his Spatial hax would be countered by his own, which can do the same.
Madness Manipulation doesn't work. The entire idea of madness is that you are afflicting it onto a mental state. That's not going to affect someone who doesn't need a mind to operate when Xehanort can just function as a heart and still be effective because of this guy. Same thing for Disease Manipulation which unless it affects purely abstract beings, won't do shit.
Xehanort resists Time Stop. Literally every Keyblade wielder gets it from the fact even Data Sora's Keyblade is what allowed him to defy the Time Stop in Agrabah.
Xehanort resists Spatial Manipulation, he's practically a borderline Comp Organization XIII in this key and Xigbar is able to resist Spatial Manipulation and it scales to him.
Unless the BFR is sending him somewhere special, that's irrelevant. Xehanort has Dimensional Travel to a 2-C Range. It was already accepted that traversing the Corridors of Darkness gives you that.
Yes we do, what are you on about? You can scale resistances, especially if they're granted from like an item. He wasn't given that resistance just because "Oh he's stronger" or anything like that. You realize Super Forms in Archie all got resistance to Law Manipulation from using the same source of power, right?, Or how about the fact anyone wielding the Triforce piece in Zelda gets auto resistance to Soul Manip? This is simply false in every way.
Speedster pretty much summed up why the BFR would still be bypassed.
Everything we talked about was mentioned, that's literally how a fucking Heartless and Nobody naturally works that when a Keyblade wielder casts away their form as a somebody, they become a Heartless and have a Nobody. That's literally on the very verse page for Kingdom Hearts regarding those terminologies. Everything mentioned has either been accepted verse wide or is on the page.
Dante Demon Killah wrote:
We don't scale Resistances like that
Dante also had Dimensional Travel and he couldn't save himself against Mundus' BFR
Also, keep in mind that we can't use anything that isn't on his profile, this includes some of the stuff you posted
I keep my vote for Mundus
The Keyblade was the thing that defended against the Time Stop, which was already accepted on the CRT, and Xehanort's past self was unaffected by Time Stop.
Aqua has Dimensional Travel with the Keyblade and couldn't escape the Realm of Darkness, and yet the Corridors of Darkness can travel there, Xehanort's method of range.
Everything I mentioned was accepted here and is on his profile.
Past Self but what about actual self ? The profile says he only resists in certain conditions
Also, this guy starts without his mind ? Or he just doesn't have one ? Because if he have one and doesn't start without it, he'll get haxed before he can do anything, and he can't disable his mind after getting haxed
Young Xehanort, his past self, was given the power to resist it by current Xehanort, the under certain circumstances was objectively wrong and already changed.
Refer to what I said earlier, because if something quite literally doesn't need something to function for their overall existence, then any form of attacking Xehanort mentally isn't going to do anything, period. KH characters with strongest hearts have literally had their minds attacked and they got through it because of their heart, and Xehanort literally has the strongest heart in the series and functioned without a kind while as Ansem.
Uh... no? Nowhere in the profile does it note that at all lol. We already went over that every Keyblade Wielder got resistance to Time Stop from Data-Sora's Keyblade scaling. Examples would be Riku, Ventus, Ephemer, etc.
Xehanort fra, also adding onto the time resistance, at least 3 of Xehanort's vessels off the top of my head he merged with in Scala had resistance to time manipulation: Terra-Xehanort, Young Xehanort, and Luxord.