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  • I genuinely believe this would be a cool match, let's hope this is fair.

    Beast I Goetia and Base Doom (Can be change if it becomes unfair for both side). Speed equal.

    Doctor Doom Fan art
    Goetia FGO
    Doctor Doom:

    Goetia: 7

    Inconclusive:

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    • Doom thinks?

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    • Goetia rips out Doom's mind and soul on eye contact.

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    • where does the soul resistnce come from?

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    • Wait

      Did that get removed from Doom's page?

      Huh.....

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    • Resistance to Soul Manip is only under prep, not base, in Doom's profile.

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    • Noticed 10 minutes ago

      Which, sounds odd to be honest

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    • Doom easily power steals

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    • How does Doom's power steal work?

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    • Thought based

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    • Does he open with it? Goetia's soul rip on eye contact is passive.

      Also, I meant what kind of abilities can he steal and from what kind of targets? Can he steal from inanimate objects? Can he steal natural abilities like the powers of mutants (like, say, Wolverine's regen)? And up to what scale? I doubt Doom can steal Noble Phantasms, since they're by nature an intrinsic part of him - take them away and they become useless unless the NP in question has been specified to be capable of being used by people other than their original owners.

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    • Considering the Power Cosmic is >>>>> anything in Nasuverse short of Akasha and Doom can steal that...

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    • I feel like he almost certainly resists it in base.

      Without prep, he's power stolen the Power Cosmic from the likes of the Silver Surfer and I think once even Galactus. With prep, he's beaten tier 1s.

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    • We're using base Doom, though. Power Cosmic is in a separate key on his profile unless I'm reading it wrong.

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    • Notably, the power cosmic thing was done with an outdated version that doom has since greatly improved on.

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    • Wait

      It's eye contact?

      Goetia cant make eye contact over a 4KM distance away

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    • Base Doom has the power siphon harness integrated into his armor. He stole the Power Cosmic using that and jumped to 4-B in doing so.

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    • So Doom can only power steal with physical contact, based on the scans from this page. Without the power cosmic giving him precog and clairvoyance, how can he catch Goetia who knows he can do this due to his own clairvoyance? And what's stopping Goetia from going back in time and incinerating Doom as a baby?

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    • Look at all the energy absorption scans.

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    • The power harness is a prep tool...

      -He has regular energy absorption capabilties however

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    • The last scan under power steal with the siphon suit (an improved version of which is now integrated into his main armor) is also not on touch.

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    • Okay... so? The energy absorption seems relatively short ranged compared to eye contact, and the power harness (according to Zensum) is a prep tool, which he doesn't have.

      Note that F/SN Archer, a massively inferior HS, could easily count the exact amount of tiles that comprise the surface of a bridge multiple kilometres away, and can shoot a target with pinpoint accuracy anywhere within a 4km radius of himself.

      Goetia can easily make eye contact over a distance of several kilometres. Hell, he doesn't even have to. He can just keep his distance and as soon as his clairvoyance tells him that Doom is a threat, he'll go back in time and incinerate baby Victor. Doom isn't acausal, and from his perspective, Goetia just disappears before he suddenly ceases to exist.

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    • Wokistan wrote:
      The last scan under power steal with the siphon suit (an improved version of which is now integrated into his main armor) is also not on touch.

      Can you link the scan that says the siphon suit is in his main armour I dont see it thx.

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    • The power harness is no longer a prep tool. He has an updated version integrated into his armor. His armor also kinda hides his eyes.

      How does he find Doom in the past? Also, Doom himself's quite the user of combat time travel himself. It's not out of the question for him to go back in anticipation upon this guy suddenly disappearing while using a familiar ability.

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    • Power Cosmic Siphon Harness: A device that Doom built that allows him to absorb the power of others. Originally a clunky harness, it has decreased in size over the years, eventually becoming a part of Doom's armor. It allows him to near-instantly drain the power of even cosmic beings such as Terrax, Silver Surfer, Watchers such as Uatu, and Galactus.

      That's already on the page. If you want the exact scan, Prom or Matt would probably know.

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    • Also, how good's Goetia's mind resist? Doom has his own eye contact based mindhax, and while he dislikes doing it he'd probably use it if they meet eyes and his soul starts getting ripped out.

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    • Yeah i'll ask. I don't recall any instance of him power absorbing those chars without his prep cosmic harness. He can absorb weaker energys on the spot though.

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    • Goetia's soul rip is passive and will be instant since Doom has no resistance to it. His own resistance to mindhax is irrelevant.

      Goetia's Clairvoyance is superior to Merlin's, who can perceive everything within his era down to the tiniest of details. Goetia's version can perceive, past, present and future. He'd easily find past!Doom, and without clairvoyance of his own to realize what Goetia's intending to do, present!Doom won't make it in time to stop him.

      Besides, Goetia doesn't need to find past!Doom. It's in-character for him to incinerate the surface of the planet if it suits his goals, since his life's mission involves doing exactly that.

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    • Galactus and Uatu were probably prep. With how many times he's done it to SS though, that may not have always been.

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    • So Goetia surface wipes ... what does Doom do in response?

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    • In past or present?

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    • Goetia surface wipes the past, erasing all possible futures from that point onwards that isn't a smoldering rock that was once Earth. Doom ceases to exist.

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    • So the only way Doom is winning here is by instantly powerdraining/whatever lethal hax he has that can hit Goetia fast enough, while Goetia will instantly Ars Almadel via his precog.

      Goetia for me for now, until someone proofs that Doom instantly killhaxes the moment the fight starts.

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    • If doom thinks to follow into the past he can just shield his infant self. Lemme look into where he was born though, I vaguely remember it being a really strange location. Is Goetia going to destroy a planet like that just for this one dude though?

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    • Like i said, it's his life's mission to use humanity as a source of fuel for his plans. From his perspective, the more the better. And again, Doom won't know what Goetia's doing, since from his perspective, the dude just disappeared into nothing. Since he doesn't have the Power Cosmic, he doesn't have the clairvoyance to realize that Goetia's planning to wipe him (and the rest of humanity) from existence.

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    • Wokistan wrote:
      If doom thinks to follow into the past he can just shield his infant self. Lemme look into where he was born though, I vaguely remember it being a really strange location. Is Goetia going to destroy a planet like that just for this one dude though?

      The entire plot of that singularity was, that Goetia wanted to smolder the surface for his plans, having an extra reason to do so because of an existing threat is just an icing on the cake. 

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    • It's a power he's familiar with and has used several times before in the exact same way. He's probably smart enough to figure out what's going on there.

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    • So Doom travels back to protect his baby self and gets erased anyway. From my POV, Doom literally needs knowledge and/or prep to even have a chance at winning this fight.

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    • Assuming he can figure out that Goetia did go back in time, how will he know what point in time Goetia travelled to? Again, no clairvoyance. Experience can only go so far. Goetia could have easily travelled anywhere between just before Doom got his powers, to the birth of Doom's oldest ancestors. There is no way Doom is defending from getting himself time paradoxed out of existence.

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    • So like

      Why are we assuming Goetia can make eye contact with Doom from 4KM away over the horizon?

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    • Gargoyle One wrote:
      So like

      Why are we assuming Goetia can make eye contact with Doom from 4KM away over the horizon?

      Who does? The current argument is clairvoyance leading to Goetia smolding the surface and killing Doom. Or travel back to any time period where Doom is less dangerous and killing him there.

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    • Solacis

      Literally half the argument.

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    • Solacis wrote:

      Note that F/SN Archer, a massively inferior HS, could easily count the exact amount of tiles that comprise the surface of a bridge multiple kilometres away, and can shoot a target with pinpoint accuracy anywhere within a 4km radius of himself.

      Goetia can easily make eye contact over a distance of several kilometres.

      ^^^ If it's over the horizon, then that's fine if he can't. However, Doom has flight, so the horizon isn't as much a flat limit to eye contact as it normally would be. So as soon as Doom looks into his eyes, his soul's getting sent to purgatory. With Doom not knowing Goetia can even do this, he won't know not to do it.

      Besides, Doom still can't defend from being erased via time paradox.

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    • Goetia is pretty big and the horizon for a human is tens of kilometers away, SBA puts them at 4km max which means Goetia can see Doom perfectly fine while Doom will be looking at Beast I's ugly face.

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    • Actually, horizon at sea level for the average human is ~4.7km away, but yeah, SBA makes it so that eye contact is technically possible right at the start of the match. Although, looking it up, SBA also says that this fight takes place in Central Park, NYC, unless specified otherwise, so there enough obstacles anyway to make this particular point moot.

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    • Doom probably has soul resistance, but no feats, so that's too bad. His basic power absorption is like 4-B anyways. Goetia probably has the means to take him down easier than Doom can off the bat, Doom may be too arrogant for it.

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    • Bump

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    • Oh well

      Goetia FRA

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    • Goetia FRA.

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    • If Doom just had prep...

      Gotita FRA.

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    • >Gotita

      Batista? ovo

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    • Eh, I'm convinced

      Goetia takes this more times than not FRA

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    • For the case it wasnt clear. I voted Goetia too, via PRECOG.

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    • One more bump

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    • goetia fra

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    • This can be added I think.

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    • A FANDOM user
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