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  • DarkDragonMedeus
    DarkDragonMedeus closed this thread because:
    Concluded
    19:18, July 26, 2018

    Gonna make this fast now. Hopefully it is not a stomp.

    Dawn Escanor vs Prime All Might.

    All Might knows about Escanor's Sunshine.

    Speed is equalized.

    Victory via any means.

    Who wins and why?

    Escanor:10 EmperorRorepme  Gargoyle One  Malikobama1 Aizenishere Xanxussama1010 ApiesDeathbyLazors PTSOXMONKEY99 Unholy Bindings DragonEmperor23 Mand21 

    All Might:1 ProfessorLord 

    Inconclusive:0

    All Might Movie Version - Young


    Young Escanor
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    • This is basically All Might vs All Might with hax and a giant axe which he can casually swing around. Gonna have to say Escanor wins. 

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    • Actually escanors heat is capable of melting someone even with their darkness armor. So this basically puts all might to where he melts by just looking at escanor

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    • bump.

      All Might is 2.32 times stronger btw.

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    • Isn't Escanor far more versatile?

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    • All Might has a solid strength advantage

      But he's weaker in pretty much every other category

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    • How about intellect? Escanor doesn't seem quite the combat smart person.

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    • >Escanor

      >Not quite Combat Smart

      Yeah no, Escanor is insanely smart, and has fought far more notable opponents on his Level then All Might ever will

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    • How quickly would Dawn Escanor surpass All Might's strength?

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    • Should take hours.

      Hmm, then All Might should get crushed. Voting Escanor until someone argues otherwise.

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    • Too slow to make a difference in raw strength, AM should still hold a decent advantage

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    • I recall Merlin described Escanor's Power level increasing by 10 every second? 

      If that held true, then it woudn't take hours for him to surpass 2.32 gigatons.

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    • BTW How High is AM into High 7A again?

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    • 2.32 Gigatons

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    • How strong is he at the time he reaches the level we're scaling him to, then? In terms of power level. You can calc it from the order of magnitude.

      If he has just 1000 in power level, it would, sure, take just less than two minutes. But if he has already like 10 000 it would take tens of minutes, and if he has like 20 000 it would take a decent fraction of an hour.

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    • That's High 7A+?


      Thought it was like 2.55 or something

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      How strong is he at the time he reaches the level we're scaling him to, then? In terms of power level. You can calc it from the order of magnitude.

      If he has just 1000 in power level, it would, sure, take just less than two minutes. But if he has already like 10 000 it would take tens of minutes, and if he has like 20 000 it would take a decent fraction of an hour.

      Doh...

      Merlin's statement is contradictory then.

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    • Gargoyle One wrote:
      That's High 7A+?


      Thought it was like 2.55 or something

      Isn't 6-C baseline at 4.3? So it takes 2.15 to get a plus. Or if you have to get the arithmetic average, then...

      oh, you're right. 2.65 is necessary. This should get edited out, sorry. I thought it had been missed and added.

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    • There's a difference between being combat experienced and being combat savy.

      I believe Escanor is fairly creative and resourceful in combat, yes, but I believe All Might is that and has more experience in combat. To be fair though, I don't know how much combat experience Dawn Escanor has, but just from reading I don't see anything to suggest otherwise.

      How would he deal with Escanor's heat manipulation? Easy, with his pseudo-air manipulation. There's nothing suggesting All Might can't casually project enough air to cushon and reject the flames off to the side, continuing this until he reaches Escanor and knocks the living shit out of him. 

      That's also suggesting All Might tries to brute force his way through, which he might, but I also think it's possible he'll use something like a 14 wheeler as a shield as he attempts to close the gap between him and Escanor... with the decent strength advantage, All Might and his suit can probably tank blows from his axe.

      Besides, All Might has taken point blank explosions from Bakugo with no damage, only uttering "owowowow" suggesting he suffered only mild irritation. I'm sure his nitroglycerin can generate comparable heat to what Escanor can.

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    • All Might's pseudo air manip has 5.3 km of reach, so yeah. He can even suck in air, which means he can create vacuum in a large enough area to cause choked flow of air towards him.

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    • First off, Bakugo, an 8C character, should not be used in any capacity and be compared to Escanor. AM was going owowowow because he is 7B to Bakugo's 8C.

      Second, AM Has to use his Air Manipulation while Escanor's heat is passively High 7A, unless he can keep generating Air Manipulation passively he is getting burned


      Thirdly, not to downplay AM, I swear, but he's only had three notable fights, AFO twice, and the Noumu, and had training by the Sexy OFA user Shimura


      Escanor


      Well


      Check his feat list

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    • I was more using Bakugo as an example of heat, not destruction. You are correct in the sense that Escanor can generate enough flames to cause more destruction than Bakugo can, but you are incorrect in assuming this means Escanor's flames must be hotter than Bakugo's. Temperature =/= Destructive Capacity. You were specifically mentioning how Escanor casually melts All Might, which is incorrect, he might be able body All Might with his flames, but he cannot melt him nor damage him whatsoever, considering that All Might had tanked point-blank nitroglycerin explosions, which again should be comparable in temperature to Escanor's flames.

      Yes, his heat manipulation is passive, but like I said it shouldn't be enough to stop All Might. Even if it was, All Might just continues to casually throw jabs, creating enough of a cushion from the heat.

      That's his notable fights, but he's had years upon years of experience fighting criminals with a variety of quirks, that's why I believe he has more combat experience.

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    • The difference is Escanor has regularly fought people on his level. Where All Might has exactly two on-screen fights, with One Off-Screen against people on his level. With one being a mindless monster. And the other being equally vauge in terms of fighting experience.

      Escanor simpily has far more feats that we know about, against more impressive people.

      Escanor's heat>>>>>>Bakugou's heat. Why is this even a debate? Escanor's heat melted a city, and was potent enough to get through some guy's darkness shield.

      Also, Explosions only generate heat for a short period of time, in some cases almost instantaneous. 

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    • Escanor can't melt All Might, if I gave off that impression, ignore it.

      Yes, but if he's ever at a point where he isn't throwing punches in a standoff or when they're both locking fists like in the AFO fight then that's when it gets to him

      Stomping fodder isn't a feat, otherwise Escanor would have the advantage as he's been fighting people before AM even got his quirk

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    • Um, All Might doesn't need to have passive defense, he just needs to keep punching forward and clearing great amounts of fire (all of it in a 5.3km radius) so all he needs is, like, one punch per second? One punch every few seconds? Something like that.

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    • He doesn't punch 100 Percent of the time tho

      He does plenty of Grabs and Fist locks

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    • Problem is a lot of Escanor's fights aren't won with him outsmarting his opponent, more so than he just gets stronger as the day continues. If you want to say both are equal in terms of experience that's fine by me, you can even say Escanor has the edge, I still don't think it lets him win this one.

      Sure, but it's all about application. Nobody has told me something Escanor would in-character do that would let him shit on All Might, just that his heat manipulation would stomp, which is un-true and I'll explain why again. Combat technique, they'd both be about equal but All Might is decently stronger in this, so it won't really be as useful for Escanor. A single punch from All Might would likely break his guard and decently damage him.

      Let's properly quantify Escanor's heat. You said his heat has melted a city, which is true but misleading. His heat was hot enough to melt industrial materials, he just had enough fire to apply this heat across the city. 

      The amount of heat required to reduce steel fibre re-inforced concrete (which is a large majority of what a city is made out of) to dust varies, but is generally around 1200 ℃ according to sources . Concrete itself can't really melt since it's a composite material, but at those temperatures it no longer holds its form. Other materials such as iron and glass also melt at 1,538 ℃, so we can use this as a baseline for how hot Escanor's flames can get. (unless you have a more impressive feat?)

      Now let's see how hot Bakugo's explosions can get. It's been stated over and over that he uses nitroglycerin to create his explosions.According to wikipedia , Nitroglycerin can raise gases up to temperatures of over 5,000 °C. We can use this as a baseline for how hot Bakugo's explosions can get from source, and considering All Might has literally face-tanked it without so much as irritation, it's safe to say he can withstand this much heat.

      Bakugo's explosions produce MUCH more heat (~5,000 °C) than Escanor has demonstrated (1,538 ℃), and as such it would not bother All Might in the slightest.

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    • It's not in character for him to only punch, that's what you mean. However, if he's being camped out, there exists no such thing as trying a grapple maneuver. He will defensively punch as much as the situation calls for.

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    • Shoulda called the match "All Might vs Sun for All"

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    • Tall Might VS Tall Bright, that's what you mean!

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    • All Might vs All Bright, top that :^)

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:

      That's a whole lot of Argumentium ad Verbosium

      Did you forget that All Might only took bursts of the heat for under a second? An Explosion doesn't convect heat nearly as well as you think. Explosions primarily transfer energy via shockwaves through the air, and less from heat. Continiuous heat from Escanor's aura would absolutely wear All Might down.

      Bakugou is also 8-C, so I don't know why this is even a discussion.

      All Might has exactly ONE feat against a foe on his level. And that is someone equally as obscure in terms of experience feats as himself. Escanor has far more feats fighting against people on his level. He was stronger than Estarossa, but he didn't fodderize him. AM foddered everyone except AFO and Nomu.

      Escanor has far better experience feats. That much is non-debateable.

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    • ??????

      That's not bursts of heat, Bakugou literally held up his nitroglycerin soaked hand to All Might's face and literally detonated over and over. I'm aware explosions don't transfer heat effectively, but that's him face-tanking the source, the hottest point of an explosion, let alone a nitroglycerin explosion.

      We don't measure heat and fire's destructive capacity on how hot they are, but how much damage they can cause. Bakugou's explosions are limited in range, and as such he only has 8-C tier feats, even if his explosions are much hotter. Escanor can use flames and heat across a greater distance and range, so he has higher feats with it. 

      Tier has nothing to do with temperature. Escanor being higher tier than Bakugou doesn't mean his flames are hotter.

      Fine, Escanor is far more experienced. What else? If that's all, then his experience doesn't really let him win this fight, All Might is much stronger.

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    • For example, SCP-457 has low 7-C flames. Does this mean his fire is hotter than usual? Absolutely not, just that he has more of it. This is literally stated over and over on his profile.

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    • All Might is only 2.32 Gigatons when going all out. The AP difference is not nearly as big as you think. 

      Yes that is a series of bursts.  We see it is very clearly. If All Might is continuously taking 2,000 C+ of temperature to his whole body, he's going to start feeling it very soon.

      Also, AM has never fought someone on his level who has a weapon. Especially not a sharp one with special abilities like Rhittia.

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    • Furthermore, AM doesn't even have Heat-Resistance on his profile. So CRT or he doesn't have it, period.

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    • @ProfessorLord

      You called him misleading, but you're the one being misleading here.  Escanor didn't spread his fire over a city, in fact he didn't make fire at all.  He flared his heat aura from a central point to vaporize the enemy right in front of him; Edinburgh melted as a side effect of that central point of heat.  Furthermore, you're ignoring the fact that the guy Escanor vaporized is unaffected by natural fire, until he met Escanor only the Demon Clan's hellfire could burn him.  Bakugou is also a far lower tier than Escanor, so I don't know why you're arguing from that point in the first place.

      _________________________________________________________________________

      I vote Escanor.

      All Might technically has the AP advantage but it needs to be stressed that Escanor's High 7-A is via him just flaring his aura.  In reality I would be extremely surprised if there's much of an AP gap at all.  In addition, Escanor doesn't just emit fire, he emits heat and light.  All Might could keep punching to make a vacuum around himself in a huge radius, sure, but all that means is he'll eventually tire himself out while Escanor continues to grow more powerful.  Assuming All Might doesn't take that strategy and moves in close, the heat will make it hard for him to breathe like it did Izraf.

      The main points against All Might here are that Escanor's heat will constantly wear All Might down and that Escanor's axe slashes leave heat in his victims' wounds, continually burning them more.  Combined with the facts that All Might won't be able to see when Escanor flares his aura, and that Escanor has objectively more experience feats of fighting people on his own level, I see Escanor quickly wearing All Might down in a majority of fights.

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    • The AP difference is large enough that it is more important than vague combat experience. You haven't told me how Escanor would in-character use something to his advantage, use a strategy, nothing, just that he is more experienced, providing no examples on how his experience would be useful in this fight.

      I don't know how it being a series of bursts discredit Bakugo's explosion temperatures. It was consistent enough that it was synonymous with one long-lasting beam of explosion, All Might still face-tanking the very source aka the hottest part... and this is around 5000 c. The feat of him melting a city is only ~1500 c, seeing as how that's around the temperature glass and iron melt at. If he can tank 5000 c for a few seconds and suffer only mild irritation, than 1500 c isn't going to bother him.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:
      Furthermore, AM doesn't even have Heat-Resistance on his profile. So CRT or he doesn't have it, period.

      that's not how it works. i showed you a feat and quantified it for you. no need for crt, evidence is right there.

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    • I can place my hand on a 160C object for a short time. I'll be going "owowowowowow" Just like All Might did, but I'll survive it for that short period. But if the Air Tempature around me is 80+ C? Yeah that's going to be an issue.

      Also, CRT for AM resistances or he doesn't have it. That is just a wiki policy, deal with it.

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    • Like I said above, this "large" AP difference is mostly you ignoring context.  All Might is 2.32 times stronger than Escanor when going all out.  Ok.  He's 2.32 times stronger than Escanor literally just flaring his aura.

      You're also still completely ignoring the fact that melting Edinburgh wasn't the feat.  It was a side effect of the feat, which was vaporizing Izraf, who is unaffected by fire.  He also vaporized Izraf's Black Full-Plate armor, which protects against Purgatory Fire, which burned the Fairy King's Forest, which was flat out stated to be immune to natural fire.  The fire generated in Bakugo's nitroglycerin explosions is natural fire.  Conclusion: Escanor's heat burns All Might without issue.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:
      I can place my hand on a 160C object for a short time. I'll be going "owowowowowow" Just like All Might did, but I'll survive it for that short period. But if the Air Tempature around me is 80+ C? Yeah that's going to be an issue.

      Also, CRT for AM resistances or he doesn't have it.

      You cannot. Water at 82C causes immediate and severe scalding. Your hand would be severely burnt. You're also ignoring the fact that All Might tanks the 5000C to the face, the most sensitive part, and suffers nothing but mild irritation.

      I also told you he can use his pseudo-air manipulation to shield himself from it altogether. That's on his profile. No CRT.

      Even in his weakened form, he still has shit ton of stamina allowing him to go all-out. His profile even says "High". This is his prime form, it's far greater. He will not tire himself out from creating his air-shield.

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    • Malikobama1 wrote:
      Like I said above, this "large" AP difference is mostly you ignoring context.  All Might is 2.32 times stronger than Escanor when going all out.  Ok.  He's 2.32 times stronger than Escanor literally just flaring his aura.

      You're also still completely ignoring the fact that melting Edinburgh wasn't the feat.  It was a side effect of the feat, which was vaporizing Izraf, who is unaffected by fire.

      ^^^

      He is correct

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    • Malikobama1 wrote:
      Like I said above, this "large" AP difference is mostly you ignoring context.  All Might is 2.32 times stronger than Escanor when going all out.  Ok.  He's 2.32 times stronger than Escanor literally just flaring his aura.

      You're also still completely ignoring the fact that melting Edinburgh wasn't the feat.  It was a side effect of the feat, which was vaporizing Izraf, who is unaffected by fire.

      Then what is the quantifiable strength for Escanor in comparison to All Might? If he doesn't have one, then we scale his strength to his aura. We don't assume he's stronger than his aura if he hasn't demonstrated it. "make a crt"

      I quantified and measured what we could, which was melting a city. That only requires temperatures of ~1500C. Still nowhere close to what All Might has face-tanked.

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    • I addressed your "pseudo-air manipulation" argument in my comment above.  It's a terrible strategy for All Might to use, because Escanor's heat aura is passive while All Might would need to constantly punch around himself.  Eventually, he'll tire but Escanor will constantly grow more powerful.  Having "high" stamina is now an argument against that?  I didn't realize "high" meant "never-ending."

      > We don't assume he's stronger than his aura if he hasn't demonstrated it. "make a crt"

      Most people don't need a crt for common sense.

      > I quantified and measured what we could, which was melting a city. That only requires temperatures of ~1500C. Still nowhere close to what All Might has face-tanked.

      No, you purposely and blatantly ignored context to suit your preferred argument.

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    • You still do not get it? All Might didn't withstand that tempature, he felt pain from it. And it was in extremely short, pulsed bursts. Escanor casually vaporized a dude immune to fire.

      Difference is Escanor is casually High 7-A just from flaring his aura. AM is noly 2.32 times stronger if he's going all out.

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    • It's not a terrible strategy for All Might. Me bringing up his "high" stamina was to illustrate that even his weak form was capable of a high amount of endurance, his prime form would be enough to continually throw out casual jabs to shield himself from the heat aura.

      It's not a lot of energy for All Might, really. He casually punches out city blocks with jabs in his weak form, he should be able to flick whatever heat there is away in his prime.

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    • Anyways, my vote is already cast for the arguments I've stated above, going to bed now so I won't be able to keep responding.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      It's not a terrible strategy for All Might. Me bringing up his "high" stamina was to illustrate that even his weak form was capable of a high amount of endurance, his prime form would be enough to continually throw out casual jabs to shield himself from the heat aura.

      It's not a lot of energy for All Might, really. He casually punches out city blocks with jabs in his weak form, he should be able to flick whatever heat there is away in his prime.

      So he can flick away sunlight? I don't think so. Most of Escanor's heat is transfered via light. Air Manipulation won't do shit against that.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:
      You still do not get it? All Might didn't withstand that tempature, he felt pain from it. And it was in extremely short, pulsed bursts. Escanor casually vaporized a dude immune to fire.

      Difference is Escanor is casually High 7-A just from flaring his aura. AM is noly 2.32 times stronger if he's going all out.

      If he's high 7-A from flaring his aura, and that's his ONLY gauge of strength, then he is only high 7-A in combat as well. That's how we do scaling, like it or not. 

      All Might's style is to go all out, so not really an issue. Hundreds of 2.32 times stronger punches will easily knock Escanor out in only a few seconds.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      So he can flick away sunlight? I don't think so. Most of Escanor's heat is transfered via light. Air Manipulation won't do shit against that.

      .. and we've already discussed how Escanor's only scale in temperature is around 1500C... meanwhile All Might has face-tanked 5000C.

      His heat manipulation is useless, regardless of whether or not he uses his pseudo-air manip.

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    • All Might tries to get close.

      Escanor says "Boom"

      The entire city melts, and All Might cries out in agony from the super heated sunlight touching his whole body.

      All Might somehow stands up and tries to repeatedly punch him.

      Escanor sees through this ridiculous brawler strategy and cuts his arm off.

      The wound starts blazing with immense heat.

      This is pretty much what happens.

      But seriously. You're downplaying Escanor at this point.

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    • You're supposed to be neutral? You are the OP. You can have an opinion, but expressing your bias is not okay.

      Hahahahahah... 1500C is going to melt All Might who has easily tanked 5000C... okay.

      Regardless, if what you're describing is true (which it is not) then All Might carries 0% chance of winning this fight. Therefore this is a stomp thread.

      So are you ready to acknowledge the truth?

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      So he can flick away sunlight? I don't think so. Most of Escanor's heat is transfered via light. Air Manipulation won't do shit against that.

      .. and we've already discussed how Escanor's only scale in temperature is around 1500C... meanwhile All Might has face-tanked 5000C.

      His heat manipulation is useless, regardless of whether or not he uses his pseudo-air manip.

      He didn't tank it. You said it yourself, he still felt harmed by it. In short bursts of energy. Seriously, quit exaggerating AM's supposed Heat-Resistance. Escanor casually vaporized a dude immune to fire. Sorry, but you're reasoning was debunked a few times over. So I won't be counting that as a valid vote.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      You're supposed to be neutral? You are the OP. You can have an opinion, but expressing your bias is not okay.

      Hahahahahah... 1500C is going to melt All Might who has easily tanked 5000C... okay.

      Regardless, if what you're describing is true (which it is not) then All Might carries 0% chance of winning this fight. Therefore this is a stomp thread.

      So are you ready to acknowledge the truth?

      <Gets Debunked

      <Cries Stomp.

      K...

      Btw, Malikobama1  is the one who did the heavily lifting with the debunking, not me.

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    • Sure, I've acknowledged he felt minor pain from 5000C hitting the most sensitive part of his body. It still left no permanent damage, no burns, nothing. There is no way 1500C is going to melt All Might, nor damage him.

      "Immunity" is generally a NLF. There's very few cases of true "immunity". This is described in greater detail on the Invulnerability page. There's no way for him to vaporize someone who was "truly" immune, otherwise they wouldn't have been considered "truly" immune.

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    • Despite supposedly remaining neutral, you've yet to count votes against All Might.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      Sure, I've acknowledged he felt minor pain from 5000C hitting the most sensitive part of his body. It still left no permanent damage, no burns, nothing. There is no way 1500C is going to melt All Might, nor damage him.

      "Immunity" is generally a NLF. There's very few cases of true "immunity". This is described in greater detail on the Invulnerability page. There's no way for him to vaporize someone who was "truly" immune, otherwise they wouldn't have been considered "truly" immune.

      Pain from short bursts of that tempature. Not a continiuous stream like Escanor's aura.

      Why is this so incredibly ard for you to understand?

      I don't count votes that have bad-reasoning and/or been debunked. Sorry, but that is just how it works. But if it makes you stop it with the Argumentium ad Nauseum, fine. I will count it.

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    • Because that's not how it works? I don't even think you've watched the video, it's a consistent stream of explosion to his face. That's him tanking a consistent stream of ~5000C versus Escanor's aura of ~1500C. This is not going to harm All Might lmao.

      You don't understand yourself, you were just trying to scale his temperature to his tier a few minutes ago before I had to explain to you that's not how we do things on the wiki.

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    • Those are very clearly pulsed explosions, with a slight delay between each detonation. And it wasn't touching his face like you claim.

      AM withstood like 3 seconds of that energy. Escanor's aura is going to add up, since it will be constant and inescapable.

      In any case, the reasoning for Escanor is simply far better.

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    • You're right in a way, he isn't directly touching his face though it is mere inches away. This wouldn't matter a lot, it's still very much self-contained within their little bubble of space. Even if you halved the amount of heat, it would still be around 2500C causing no damage or injury whatsoever.

      Meanwhile, you're trying to argue that Escanor's aura of 1500C is going to melt him... lol

      Worse case scenario, there's nothing stopping All Might from jumping away into a cooler area for a few seconds before returning to beat Escanor's ass.

      Other than vague experience and less than optimal conditions for All Might (with the heat and all) there's nothing stopping him from winning with his strength advantage. 

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    • I never said it would melt him. I said that it would hurt All Might, and make it very difficult for him to get close.

      Again, he vaporized someone immune to fire. Stop downplaying Escanor.

      Escanor slices All Might's arms of with Rhittia, while any other wounds he receives will continue to burn.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      At most, it will be less than optimal for All Might. It will not hurt All Might, he was midly irritated by much hotter temperatures.

      You can't quantify vaporizing someone immune to fire, I'm sorry. You can quantify melting a city, which is only ~1500C as I have stated before. It's not downplay, there's just a lack of feats for his supposedly superior temperature.

      All Might has strength advantage... but he'll let Escanor somehow slice his arms off...

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    • Voting Escanor for Malikos reasons.

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    • Escanor fra

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    • Why are Escanor's flames so hotly debated? All Might is gonna punch them away or back against Escanor. He can punch stuff the horizon away.

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    • All Might fra, All Might would be able to keep away Escanor's heat aura since in his prime he creates gusts of wind just by moving. All Might should also have more expierence fighting since Escanor pretty much stomps in most fights he's in and as a result of that he never built up that much skill when his pure strength outmatches the opponent to where talent doesn't matter.

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    • not to mention all might has explicitly tanked hotter... but because its passive and an aura, all might is going to go full retard and suffocate himself fighting escanor rather than backing off when its starting to fatigue him.

      also all might is explicitly over 2x stronger in this matchup

      but escanor has more vague combat experience but nobody will tell me how it will used in this fight... so yeah all might tooootally gets shit on

      mand21 did u switch to all might or nah?

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    • I did. I don't think All Might has heat resistance or can tank heat that well because of the explosion vs fire jet disparity but that's a non-issue given how easily he counters the flames.

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    • so there's 6 votes for escanor and 3 votes for all mighty

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    • also, i think it was brought up that escanor uses light to transfer his heat, no flames?

      i dont know escanor too well so i can't speak to the validity of this, but i do know that heat transfer through radiation is the slowest possible form of heat transfer.

      the ambient heated air and flames cannot transfer through all mights pseduo-air manipulation vacuum created with his casual jabs, but this light radiation should be able to bypass it. it doesnt matter very much though, like i said its the slowest possible form of heat transfer. this means all might has all the time in the world to approach escanor, give him a few hundred punches and retreat out of his passive heat aura to recover. hit and run tactics. he's explicitly used this against all for one.

      not only that but he can just cover his face with his cape or any sort of helmet and that can reduce a great amount of the ambient heat from the light. point is, his ambient heat will be a none-issue for anyone with a degree of competence. coupled with the fact that he's over x2 stronger, and this match is over real soon. he can probably skip hit and run tactics all together, and just give escanor his 110% beatdown. with the attack difference, escanor can very easily be knocked out.

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    • and yes, all might is over x2 stronger than escanors durability and attack potency. escanors page explicitly scales his durability from his attack potency.

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    • Escanor FRA

      Grace begins now.

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    • The main points against All Might here are that Escanor's heat will constantly wear All Might down and that Escanor's axe slashes leave heat in his victims' wounds, continually burning them more.  Combined with the facts that All Might won't be able to see when Escanor flares his aura, and that Escanor has objectively more experience feats of fighting people on his own level, I see Escanor quickly wearing All Might down in a majority of fights.

      This is Malik's post where everyone is voting for Escanor from. The heat issue has already been addressed above. The part with Esca's axe leaving heat wouldn't be that much of a problem since All Might's Durability is around the same as his AP meaning that his axe wouldn't be leaving very large wounds in All Might making the heat in the wounds a non problem.When has Escanor ever fought someone on his level before? All his fights were stomps in his favor besides the beginning of Estarossa vs Escanor where the only reason Escanor won because he outlasted Estarossa for his power boost and not because of skill. Even against AM Meliodas he was getting stomped until he pulled out The One and then stomped Mel. Escanor's battle strategy consists of swing my axe and use sunshine fireball. He has no skill because he's never fought someone on the same level due to how his power works.

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    • Guys, won't All Might be punching all of Escanor's flames back onto his face when the fight begins with a distance of 4km between them? That has to count for something.

      And yeah, Escanor's strategy is all about "fight while holding your own until you get the power needed to stomp your enemy". There is no reason to believe he'd hold his own against an opponent capable of tanking his 2 minutes of High 6-B power level.

      Because All Might has shown the ability to deal with people both stronger and weaker than him, faster and slower, sturdier and frailer, he should have more experienced even if Escanor has fought more varied enemies, as Escanor never internalized or intellectualized his fighting experiences due to them all being "foolish guy tries to attack me lol now he can't damage me lolstomp"

      So yeah, these votes for Escanor aren't all that real. And doesn't OP show five votes for All Might? Why are those dead?

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    • DragonEmperor23 wrote:
      The main points against All Might here are that Escanor's heat will constantly wear All Might down and that Escanor's axe slashes leave heat in his victims' wounds, continually burning them more.  Combined with the facts that All Might won't be able to see when Escanor flares his aura, and that Escanor has objectively more experience feats of fighting people on his own level, I see Escanor quickly wearing All Might down in a majority of fights.

      This is Malik's post where everyone is voting for Escanor from. The heat issue has already been addressed above. The part with Esca's axe leaving heat wouldn't be that much of a problem since All Might's Durability is around the same as his AP meaning that his axe wouldn't be leaving very large wounds in All Might making the heat in the wounds a non problem.When has Escanor ever fought someone on his level before? All his fights were stomps in his favor besides the beginning of Estarossa vs Escanor where the only reason Escanor won because he outlasted Estarossa for his power boost and not because of skill. Even against AM Meliodas he was getting stomped until he pulled out The One and then stomped Mel. Escanor's battle strategy consists of swing my axe and use sunshine fireball. He has no skill because he's never fought someone on the same level due to how his power works.

      Is everyone seriously ignoring all of the context behind Escanor?

      What is with the downplay?

      If your wounds are onstantly burning, you're going to be screaming in agony. All Might is 2.32 times stronger when going all out. Escanor is High 7-A from literally ust standing.

      All Might's experience feats don't compare to escanor... like at all.

      This vote will not be counted. It's still based off faulty reasoning and Argumentium ad Verbosium.

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      Guys, won't All Might be punching all of Escanor's flames back onto his face when the fight begins with a distance of 4km between them? That has to count for something.

      Because All Might has shown the ability to deal with people both stronger and weaker than him, faster and slower, sturdier and frailer, he should have more experienced even if Escanor has fought more varied enemies, as Escanor never internalized or intellectualized his fighting experiences due to them all being "foolish guy tries to attack me lol now he can't damage me lolstomp"

      So yeah, these votes for Escanor aren't all that real. And doesn't OP show five votes for All Might? Why are those dead?

      Escanor is immune to his own heat. And it's not flames. It's fucking sunlight. How do you punch sinlight?

      No he has not. All Might has only fought AFO, and Nomu. One is a mindless monster, the other is equally vuage in experience feats.

      The votes for All Might are based on faulty reasoning. And to be perfectly honest, I only counted them so the All Might wankers won't make too much noise.

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    • You used my title :D

      Anyway, Escaor FRA. If he can perform a High 7A feat just by flexing his aura, then I’d imagine him gettting serious and using it in a direct attack would result in a much higher output. Escanor is just too much for All Might to handle.

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    • Also, people actually think All Might can punch away sunlight....... So that reasoning against escanor is false. I don't need to explain why

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    • In addition to the faulty logic of punching away light (which is what conveys the heat), I don’t see anywhere where the heat issue has been addressed either.  All I’ve seen is flat-out ignoring all the context behind Escanor’s heat, which vaporized a guy who fire doesn’t work on and vaporized armor that withstands hellfire that burned a forest that fire doesn’t work on.  

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    • And while were at it. Cruel Sun is like a minature sun. So wouldn't it be as hot as a real sun?

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    • So, we're in the middle of Grace, right?

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    • Also, no one seemed to counter the point that when All Might gets close he won’t be able to see due to the blinding light, and that breathing the superheated air will make things even harder for him.

      @Apies

      Yeah

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    • Escanor murders him, pure slumping isn’t saving All Might from versatile use of Eecanors sunshine, what is with you and MHA fodders?

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    • Unholy Bindings wrote:
      Escanor murders him, pure slumping isn’t saving All Might from versatile use of Eecanors sunshine, what is with you and MHA fodders?

      Normally I wouldn't really like this attitude towards MHA you have. But yeah, there is clear bias in favor of All Might here.

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    • @Versus @Unholy

      Nah man that attitude shouldn't be tolerated either way.

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    • PTSOXMONKEY99 wrote:
      You used my title :D

      Anyway, Escaor FRA. If he can perform a High 7A feat just by flexing his aura, then I’d imagine him gettting serious and using it in a direct attack would result in a much higher output. Escanor is just too much for All Might to handle.

      wrong and completely incorrect. if he is high 7A by flexing his aura and that is his only guage of strength, then he is equally as strong in combat. this is how things work on the wiki. a direct attack would result with an equal output. 

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      PTSOXMONKEY99 wrote:
      You used my title :D

      Anyway, Escaor FRA. If he can perform a High 7A feat just by flexing his aura, then I’d imagine him gettting serious and using it in a direct attack would result in a much higher output. Escanor is just too much for All Might to handle.

      wrong and completely incorrect. if he is high 7A by flexing his aura and that is his only guage of strength, then he is equally as strong in combat. this is how things work on the wiki. a direct attack would result with an equal output. 

      No.

      Your AP when actually fighting seriously with first and/or a weapon>>>> your AP from standing still and flexing.

      This is common sense

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    • Malikobama1 wrote:
      Also, no one seemed to counter the point that when All Might gets close he won’t be able to see due to the blinding light, and that breathing the superheated air will make things even harder for him.

      @Apies

      Yeah

      all might isn't a retard. you guys got really upset that i'm ignoring escanor's combat experience, but here you are blatantly doing the same. if all might can't see dont you think he'd, i dunno, grab a pair of sunglasses?

      all might can also hold his breath lmao

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      No.

      Your AP when actually fighting seriously with first and/or a weapon>>>> your AP from standing still and flexing.

      This is common sense

      no. there is no feat indicating his combat strength, therefore it scales from his aura. this is how things work like it or not.

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    • <Grab a pair of sunglasses to block out a living sun

      <Hold his breath

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4

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    • ad hominem rather than adressing the actual counter-points.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      No.

      Your AP when actually fighting seriously with first and/or a weapon>>>> your AP from standing still and flexing.

      This is common sense

      no. there is no feat indicating his combat strength, therefore it scales from his aura. this is how things work like it or not.

      No it isn't. You're just trying to apply your own arbitrary belief.

      If you can generate x amount of energy by literally standing and not moving. You can logically generate far more energy when actually trying.

      This is objectively how it actually works.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      ad hominem rather than adressing the actual counter-points.

      What counter points?

      Where is All Might gonna get sunglasses from? If they're not of High 7-A durability, they'll be vaproized.....

      Hold his breath while actively fighting? I don't think so.

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    • I understand the thought process, but we don't know how much combat strength he has. We only know how much strength his aura can radiate. You can't assume how much combat strength he has because we don't know.

      Therefore, what we do is we scale it to something we can guage; his aura. His combat strength must scale to his aura, assuming anything else would be unfair. This is how we do things on the wiki. Escanor will never be stronger than All Might in this fight.

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    • All Might is at best 50% stronger than Escanor. And that gap will close as his Sunshine passively amps his own power.

      You still ignore that 2.32 gigatons is All Might's absolute maximum power.

      I'm not going to continue.Malikobama1's reasons alone close this debate.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      What counter points?

      Where is All Might gonna get sunglasses from? If they're not of High 7-A durability, they'll be vaproized.....

      Hold his breath while actively fighting? I don't think so.

      Again, that's correlating Escanor's fire and light with High 7-A damage, which is not true.. Temperature =/= Destructive Capacity, the only reason Escanor has High 7-A was because his light and fire could destroy an area as large as it would quantify. This does not mean his light is High 7-A in damage, but can cause enough damage to warrant High 7-A. 

      SBA assumes fight takes place in Central Park. All Might borrows a bystanders glasses, or goes to a clothing shop. It's not far-fetched. Same with holding his break while fighting. Going 110% with hundreds of punches will knock Escanor out because of strength difference, he doesn't need to hold it that long.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      I'm not going to continue.Malikobama1's reasons alone close this debate.

      aaaand the biased OP everyone

      (you were never going to let all might win)

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      I'm not going to continue.Malikobama1's reasons alone close this debate.

      aaaand the biased OP everyone

      (you were never going to let all might win)

      So you call me biassed because I am challenging your own points and agreeing with someone else?

      Real classy.

      It's called debating. You're damn right I want Escanor to win. I am debating for Escanor.

      If I didn't want All Might to win, I could've easily twisted the OP that way. But I made it as fair as possible.

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    • @Professor

      I’d imagine that a casual, unfocused blast is a lot weaker than a serious attack that can be focused into a single area. He uses that energy in his attacks all the time. And All Might’s Hugh 7A attack was him going all out, and he straight up admits that he doesn’t use 100% of his strength all the time.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      What counter points?

      Where is All Might gonna get sunglasses from? If they're not of High 7-A durability, they'll be vaproized.....

      Hold his breath while actively fighting? I don't think so.

      Again, that's correlating Escanor's fire and light with High 7-A damage, which is not true.. Temperature =/= Destructive Capacity, the only reason Escanor has High 7-A was because his light and fire could destroy an area as large as it would quantify. This does not mean his light is High 7-A in damage, but can cause enough damage to warrant High 7-A. 

      SBA assumes fight takes place in Central Park. All Might borrows a bystanders glasses, or goes to a clothing shop. It's not far-fetched. Same with holding his break while fighting. Going 110% with hundreds of punches will knock Escanor out because of strength difference, he doesn't need to hold it that long.

      What???

      If All Might borrows something from a civilian (Who wouldn't even be nearby to begin with) whatever he borrows would just be vaporized by Escanor's passive light. That will not help him.

      Ever tried fighting while holding your beath? All Might has never done any such thing, let alone effecitvely.

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    • I am calling you biased because you are clearly in favor of Escanor. This is beyond providing counter-arguments, you have already claimed that the reasons in favor of Escanor end this debate without considering the counter-arguments against him.

      You are the OP. You shouldn't be in favor of a character winning, it's called removing your bias. You can like a character more, but expressing and actively supporting one character in a debate is not acceptable.

      There is other ways to express spite and stomp, not just in the OP.

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      I am calling you biased because you are clearly in favor of Escanor. This is beyond providing counter-arguments, you have already claimed that the reasons in favor of Escanor end this debate without considering the counter-arguments against him.

      You are the OP. You shouldn't be in favor of a character winning, it's called removing your bias. You can like a character more, but expressing and actively supporting one character in a debate is not acceptable.

      There is other ways to express spite and stomp, not just in the OP.

      First off, I am one of the biggest supporters of MHA with All Might being one of my favorite characters. I've got literally no reason to spite against him.

      I am the OP. But I reserve the right to debate. I don't buy the ridiculous idea that an OP shouldn't. No matter how unfair you think that is, I make threads so I can debate in them as well. Otherwise, why make it in the first place?

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    • We can't really go based on your words, we just have to judge by how you've been acting in the thread, and there's nothing but blatant bias which you have now just admitted.

      Once an OP starts debating in favor of a character it develops what we call a bias. This is why providing counter-arguments as OP is fine, but full on debating in favor of one side is not. You cannot actively support one character in a debate, you need to remove yourself and let it play out.

      OP is the one that counts and controls the votes. 

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    • ProfessorLord wrote:
      We can't really go based on your words, we just have to judge by how you've been acting in the thread, and there's nothing but blatant bias which you have now just admitted.

      Once an OP starts debating in favor of a character it develops what we call a bias. This is why providing counter-arguments as OP is fine, but full on debating in favor of one side is not. You cannot actively support one character in a debate, you need to remove yourself and let it play out.

      And you're not biased in favor of All Might? Ever considered that? Pot calling the Kettle Black.

      Your responses are literred with Appeal to Motive fallacies in a desperate attempt to dismiss my own arguments.

      Providing Counter-Arguments is exactly what I am doing. I reserve the right to debate. I made the thread, I'm absolutely going to debate on it. 

      Sorry if that upsets you so much, but it is what it is.

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    • Um, OPs can debate. It's often necessary. What they cannot do is vote. Also, the Cruel Sun doesn't need to be as hot as the sun, just as its surface at best. Not even that if it's contradicted/doesn't have support.

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      Um, OPs can debate. It's often necessary. What they cannot do is vote. Also, the Cruel Sun doesn't need to be as hot as the sun, just as its surface at best. Not even that if it's contradicted/doesn't have support.

      ^^^

      This.

      We OP's cannot vote, but we can debate.

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    • I am biased in favor of All Might, but I'm not the one counting the votes.

      Going based on what you've admitted:

      - All Might cannot counter a passive heat aura, it will severely burn him from a distance away

      - Despite All Might having strength advantage, Escanor is stronger because that strength disparity is between his aura not his own combat strength (we have no guage for his combat strength but your assuming is far higher)

      - Escanor is more intelligent and more combat experienced

      - Escanor has a sharp weapon and is able to cut All Might's arms off

      How is this a fair fight then? In what scenario does All Might win?

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    • All Might can still attack at range with his shockwaves, as he massively outranges Escanor. If he manages to, in the unlikely scenario get the drop on Escanor, he might be able to knock him out.

      I never claimed Escanor is stronger than All Might. I claimed that the strength gap is not as big as you claim it to be.

      Because he can't, that much is true.

      Objectively, Escanor does.

      He has a weapon... All Might is unarmed.

      A decisive match is not a stomp/spite. I don't know how many times people gotta go over this.

      Everything I and others have said is just the truth.

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    • I still don't get why you think Escanor is more skilled. He has no skill because his fights don't need it. If his opponent is stronger than him, he just waits for Sunshine to buff him and then stomps them. Escanor has literally never fought someone as strong as him because due to how his power works if there is someone as strong as him then they're not going to be because in a few seconds he can stomp them.

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    • You obviously have not read, or watched Nanatsu no Taizai.

      Escanor is still skilled in using his axe, and fighting against a variety of enemies. Brawlers like All Might included.

      All Might has exactly one on-screen fight against someone on his level, who is equally vauge experience wise.

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    • Furthermore. You do realize, that All Might also doesn't have to be skilled? He is a brute force fighter because he fodders literally everyone except Nomu and AFO.

      Escanor has at the very least fought against people nearly comparable to himself.

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:
      Furthermore. You do realize, that All Might also doesn't have to be skilled? He is a brute force fighter because he fodders literally everyone except Nomu and AFO.

      He even brute forced them. The only skill he showed was a feint againts AFO, and that still boils down to punch him harder.

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    • All Might's "Skill" boils down to "Punch them till they go down" Escanor's Skills are more advanced then that.

      And you know why? Because unlike Escanor, he fodders  literally everyone he goes up against, except for two guys. Escanor has at the least fought people nearly comparable to him. (Estarossa/Mael) And Meliodas himself.

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    • Also just to add to the "how hot his aura is"

      It uh.. melted a 7-A so there's that.

      On top of that a 7-A who if not IMMUNE has resistance to fire and who's armor is highly resistant if not immune to purgatory fire So yea Sunshine hurts like a MOTHER and I can't see All Might not getting at the very least burned. By the lads Aura alone.

      This is in response to Proffesor saying "Again, that's correlating Escanor's fire and light with High 7-A damage, which is not true.. Temperature =/= Destructive Capacity, the only reason Escanor has High 7-A was because his light and fire could destroy an area as large as it would quantify. This does not mean his light is High 7-A in damage, but can cause enough damage to warrant High 7-A."

      It completely vaporized someone with resistance to fire and purgatory fire. The latter of which is superior to natural fire.

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    • It doesn't take skill for you to swing your axe and your enemy to die in one hit. In order for you to build skill, you would have to fight someone on the same level as you. This is the same situation as Saitama. Saitama has fought many different monsters over the years he has had his powers, but everyone knows that this does not make Saitama a skilled fighter. This is because he oneshots all of his opponents and that's why Escanor isn't skilled either. It doesn't matter what type of opponent he has faced because this is literally what happens in 99% of Escanor's fights. The 1% is Meliodas stomping Escanor until he gets stomped and Estarossa descively winning against Esca until enough time passed for Esca to stomp Esta.

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    • Except that Saitama is the god-tier of his verse and you know it. Bad comparison is bad.

      Escanor has more versatile abilities, and has dealt with people with Brawler-esque abilities.

      Escanor objectively has more skill than All Might, period. Cut the downplay already. 

      Escanor wasn't stomping Estarossa. He was generally stronger than him, but not too much else. Try again.

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    • @Dragon

      In what part of that Estarossa fight was he decively winning apart from the very end when he blacked out the cruel sun?!?!

      He blocked a punch and still got grounded. Barely tanked Cruel sun thanks to his darkness and still received burns. And Escanor was there bored as shit amused with himself.

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    • Oh and AM vs LM? Escanor got stomped yea but he also managed to take several hits and keep fighting and even drew blood from AM Meliodas despite the huge gap in power with a PUNCH.

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    • We all forgot that Escanor's durability has generally been treated as superior to his aP.

      And even if he takes hits from All Might. His Sunshine will heal him.

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    • @Versus

      How is this a bad comparison? The only thing offensive wise Escanor can do that Saitama can't is use the fireballs and heat aura. Their fights still play out the exact same way. Saitama fights Brawlers all the time that doesn't make him super skilled against people who are brawlers. What do you mean Esta didn't get stomped by Escanor? Escanor was losing and Esta was about to win then Escanor Sunshine'd up, blitzed a slice on Esta's chest and then bodied him and Zeldris at the same time with a single Cruel Sun. A blitz and a oneshot. That's literally a stomp.

      @Aizen A descive win is when one character manages to beat the other character through their abilties and skill. Estarossa regenerated from all the damage he took and full counter'd Escanor's blow. Then Estarossa blacked out Esca's move and was going to kill him. I'm saying that at this point if Escanor didn't Sunshine up then Estarossa would have won. Escanor's durability is higher than his AP though. Looking back at the fight, it starts off with Mel stomping Escanor and leaving a hellfire infused hole in his abdomen. Escanor lies down on his back but then gets up after Sunshining. Escanor would have died there without Sunshine's buff. Escanor does manage to land a hit on Meliodas but this is not because he is skilled it is because they have the same speed. You do not need skill to punch your opponent at the same time he punches you if the both of you are around the same speed.

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    • Estarossa was really only holding his own because of Full Counter. Without it, that fight would have ended much sooner.

      It's a terrible comparison because Escanor doesn't fodder everyone like you claim. He is generally stronger in many of his fights. Saitama however, is a god-tier. So yeah, bad comparison. Did you watch/read Nanatsu no Taizai at all? Or maybe you just didn't pay attention.

      But it matters not at this point. Escanor has pretty much won.

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    • Esta only used Full Counter once. Escanor does fodderize in all of the fights he's in. He fodderized the vampire king, Galan, Melascula, Drole, Gloxinia, Zeldris and Estarossa. Estarossa was stronger than him at the beginning of the fight but then he amped up and oneshotted him. Meliodas fodderized Escanor until he amped up and oneshotted Mel which takes no skill. I don't understand your logic with why it's a bad comparison. Why does Saitama being a god tier matter? I'm not saying Saitama = Escanor in strength. I'm talking about how the way their fights play out are the exact same. They both oneshot the majority of their opponents but this does not give them a skill advantage because there is no skill used for the way they fight

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    • Fine, you've got some points.

      What exactly are you trying to argue here? That All Might is more skilled? Because that has already been disproved several times over.

      Escanor more than likely received training of some degree, he was a Holy Knight after all. Plus, he also has a weapon, versus All Might who is unarmed.

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    • All Might is more skilled though, when he fought someone at the same level as him he didn't win because oneshot he won through skill. Didn't Escanor go straight from wandering the country side to being a part of the 7DS? His daylight form seems to prideful to accept training and his nighttime form is weaker than the average Holy knight by 20 times so he probably didn't get trained.

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    • All Might is not. He has exactly ONE feat against someone who is utterly featless in terms of combat experience. But on his level. And even then, the fact that All Might was able to win via brute force says enough about AfO.

      All Might fodders almost everyone in MHA, just as escanor overpowers most in TDS.

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    • "Esta only used Full Counter once. Escanor does fodderize in all of the fights he's in. He fodderized the vampire king, Galan, Melascula, Drole, Gloxinia, Zeldris and Estarossa. Estarossa was stronger than him at the beginning of the fight but then he amped up and oneshotted him."

      @Dragon

      Ok..No.

      Firstly, he uses full counter twice.

      Secondly. In the beginning of the fight he lands four clean hits on Escanor and they didn't phase him in any notable way aside from drawing blood. Escanor then landed a punch which Estarossa GUARDED and he still went on his knees. He then pulls out his blade and uses Full Counter, again Escanor isn't phased he's just amused and says something prideful. He then proceeds to Cruel Sun + Pride flare and we see he damaged Estarossa and he himself admitted if it wasn't for the darkness he'd be knee deep in crap. He blacks out the next Cruel Sun and Full counters again. Then it's just a vague scene of Estarossa declaring victory before Escanor gets amped again and well we all know how that song and dance goes. So no that wasn't a decisive win in the slightest since Escanor handed Estarossa his ass when it came to exchanging blows and literally the only moment Estarossa appeared to have an advantage was at the very end of the fight.

      That's fine though because it portrays something else that's notable: you're on the clock against Escanor. And I've yet to see one thing that suggests All Might can even deal with his Aura let alone engage in CQC with him.

      This match honestly does appear to be a stomp the more I read and it probably should be closed.

      Also his Axe can cut through 6-Bs and a 6-B can't lift it. (Granted a 6-B Whose lifting strength is around All Mights)

      So yea.. our boy All Might seems to be done in no matter how you look at it

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    • Estarossa's regen is one of his abilities though. I don't see why him regening would mean that him beating Escanor wouldn't count. It doesn't matter when your advantage comes in during a fight. It's not like if Esta only started beating Esca at the end made it so that him beating Esca doesn't count as him winning. Lord and Mand explained why the aura doesn't matter. The weapon is not country level, the person using it is. You could say that the weapon has country level durability since it didn't break on Galan but it's not like if a random holy knight could pick up Rhitta they would become Country level.

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    • No, Lord and Mand's stance on the aura were debunked. Stop lying.

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    • @Dragon

      Except he didn't beat Escanor. That's what I'm trying to tell you. In no phase of the fight was Estarossa at an advantage except the very end when it was too late. Yet for some reason you believe Estarossa was "decisively winning" when that wasn't the case in the slightest. Unless 3 seconds of glory counts as "decisively winning".

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    • So you're saying Escanor passively melts All Might? By that logic, wouldn't this be a stomp?

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    • @Aizen

      I already said what I think of as a decisive win. Estarossa had Escanor injured and neutralized his Cruel Sun. The point I was making at the time was that if Escanor hadn't Sunshine'd up then he would have lost there.

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    • Sigh...

      We NEVER claimed he melts. We just established that his aura would hurt All Might.

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    • Max did. If that's not true then his vote shouldn't count.

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    • My reasoning for All Might's win is that he can spam punches in Escanor's direction and knock him out. What do you say to counter this?

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    • DragonEmperor23 wrote:
      My reasoning for All Might's win is that he can spam punches in Escanor's direction and knock him out. What do you say to counter this?

      Passive heat aura continuously wears All Might down. Any damage Escanor receives is healed via Sunshine. 

      Escanor gradually gets stronger, closing the power gap. Escanor slices All Might with his axe, leaving a massive burning wound that causes him immense pain. 

      Being a Brawler, All Might doesn't have any answer for Rhittia.

      The votes aren't going anywhere. The reasoning the base off is fine as it is

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    • Also, because of the inverse-square law. All Might is going to need to get within melee range in order to damage Escanor. Because the energy of a shockwave drops off with distance.

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    • I'm not saying everyones votes I'm saying specifcally Max's. If someone did Goku SSB vs Escanor and they said Goku wins because his hair is blue then that vote wouldn't count because even though Goku would win his hair being bue is not the reason why. If you are saying that Escanor can't melt All Might by looking at him then Max's vote would not count since that is his reason.

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    • If I do that, then I will have to get rid of all of the votes for All Might as well. Because they are based on faulty reasoning. Are you sure you want that?

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    • Nvm that guy's reasoning is utter trash. Removing

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    • Don't forget that the energy in Rhitta isn't restricted to Escanor's current status either.  He can release increments of the energy stored within it beyond All Might's power.  I presume unleashing a full High 6-B attack isn't allowed but unleashing power beyond All Might's within the High 7-A tier is just fine.

      And with Charge and Fire he's not restricted to close-range slashes either.  He can attack at range, and All Might isn't punching or dodging his way out of sunlight.

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    • There is no want. If a vote's reasoning has been debunked then it is removed.

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    • Malikobama1 wrote:
      Don't forget that the energy in Rhitta isn't restricted to Escanor's current status either.  He can release increments of the energy stored within it beyond All Might's power.  I presume unleashing a full High 6-B attack isn't allowed but unleashing power beyond All Might's within the High 7-A tier is just fine.

      Yeah, I forgot about this.

      Couldn't Escanor activate Psuedo-Sun to give gim a few seconds as a High 6-B if he found himself to be losing?

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    • I don't know if we should assume he can activate that at will, plus it should probably be restricted in a High 7-A match anyway.

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    • SBA allows all abilities to be used, unless the OP restricts it. Right?

      But ti doesnb't matter. Psuedo-Sun is a last-resort for Escanor in this state.

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    • I don't know the specifics of that so I couldn't tell you.  But yeah, it would be an absolute last-resort for Escanor and I don't think he'd even consider it in this match.

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    • Switch my vote to Escanor fra. Even if All Might could beat Escanor normally, If he came close enough then Esca could just use Rhitta's stored up power.

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    • Aren't Escanor's higher tiered powerups restricted by default?

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      Aren't Escanor's higher tiered powerups restricted by default?

      I don't think so. Going off fo SBA, the OP needs to specify it.

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    • Then this would become a stomp if All Might can't deal with something from motherf*cking tier 6.

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    • Escanor doesn't lead with releasing Rhittia's stored energy. He still has a chance to win.

      This is a decisive match, not a stomp

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    • DragonEmperor23 wrote: @Aizen

      I already said what I think of as a decisive win. Estarossa had Escanor injured and neutralized his Cruel Sun. The point I was making at the time was that if Escanor hadn't Sunshine'd up then he would have lost there.

      Which is.. wrong.

      "A descive win is when one character manages to beat the other character through their abilties and skill. Estarossa regenerated from all the damage he took and full counter'd Escanor's blow. Then Estarossa blacked out Esca's move and was going to kill him. I'm saying that at this point if Escanor didn't Sunshine up then Estarossa would have won."

      Ok.. well the problem here is Estarossa didn't beat Escanor. So it's not a win in any sense of the word.

      1. Estarossa healed the wounds but as we know demons don't recover from the damage dealt to them. So unless he's suddenly immortal now the damage was still done.

      2. "And was going to kill him" ????? Via what exactly? He did nothing but piss Escanor off.

      Lastly, listen m8 we could back and forth about this but it wasn't a win for Estarossa like.. at all. You say if Escanor didn't shunshine up he would've lost well guess what if Estarossa didn't bust out the darkness he would've lost sooner.

      I really can't fathom how you can say "Estarossa would've if...." ?? Both characters had an arsenal and Escanor won out. When Estarossa thought he had the upper hand he got one-shotted. That's not a decisive win that's getting absolutely demolished.

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    • Escanor doesn't need to release Tier 6 energy, he can just release energy that's more powerful than All Might within Tier High 7-A.  That's not enough to stomp.

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    • No Aizen I didn't say Esta won, I was saying Esta was going to win because he was fully healed while Escanor was injured and his Cruel Sun was blacked out. If Esca hadn't sunshine'd up then Esta would have won. I'm not saying his win didn't count because he used Sunshine, I was using the fight as a point that Esca stomps all of his opponents.

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    • Just saying, that if it weren't for Full Counter. Estarossa wouldn't have fought against Escanor as well as he did.

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    • If it's not enough to stomp, then there's no reason All Might's powers wouldn't defend him. He can literally camp Escanor as his shockwaves should, just like Izuku's still retain a decent amount of their striking strength for the first meters (in his case, probably the first dozen or hundred meters). And even though that's not his fighting style, he wouldn't be dumb to throw himself in danger against an enemy he knows he might get f*cked by if he gives up on strategical fighting. He's smart, so I don't see how Escanor's flame projectiles or heat protecting him at close range are so useful.

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    • All Might can't use shock waves to punch away heat conveyed by light, so making this into a range match is a bad idea.  His shock waves will quickly lose energy b/c inverse square law and the little damage he does from a large distance will be healed by Sunshine's low-level regen. All the while Escanor grows stronger.  Getting even a moderate distance away will let Escanor keep firing off sunlight attacks from Rhitta.  Again, Escanor does not use flame projectiles except for Cruel Sun, his attacks are conveyed by flashes of his sunlight.  All you need to do is go back and look at him killing Izraf and him using Charge and Fire to see that.

      All Might's dilemna summed up:

      Stay at moderate range and risk continuous Rhitta attacks that he can't punch away or dodge, resulting in him quickly losing.

      Move into CQC where the light will blind him, he'll barely be able to breathe, the heat will continually wear down his HP, and he risks getting hit by the axe directly while he can't see.  Any wounds dealt are imbued with continual heat, sapping All Might's HP even more quickly and giving him constant pain to deal with.

      This isn't a stomp because All Might can damage Escanor and if he plays his cards right he could win, but imo it's a decisive victory for Escanor because his powerset is a terrible matchup for someone like All Might.

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    • DragonEmperor23 wrote: No Aizen I didn't say Esta won, I was saying Esta was going to win because he was fully healed while Escanor was injured and his Cruel Sun was blacked out. If Esca hadn't sunshine'd up then Esta would have won. I'm not saying his win didn't count because he used Sunshine, I was using the fight as a point that Esca stomps all of his opponents.

      Except he wasn't fully healed as that's not how demon regen works and it's up for debate if Escanor was really injured.

      But I hear you loud and clear now m8 so I'm done with it. Cheers

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    • Grace is over.  Escanor wins 9-2

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    • THANK GOD

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    • why couldn't All Might punch away Rhitta attacks?

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    • Why couldn't Escanor just fist lock him or slice him with an axe or burn him conventionally or grow stronger then him or anything that literally everyone who voted Escanor said a dozen times already?

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    • 1 - Because All Might is sufficiently stronger for the axe to have reduced effectiveness.

      2 - Because All Might is capable of punching the fire away and back into Escanor himself with sufficient force to cause damage, making camping counter-productive.

      3 - Because that would happen too slowly, sufficiently slowly for All Might to have already overwhelmed Escanor by the time it happens.

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      1 - Because All Might is sufficiently stronger for the axe to have reduced effectiveness.

      2 - Because All Might is capable of punching the fire away and back into Escanor himself with sufficient force to cause damage, making camping counter-productive.

      3 - Because that would happen too slowly, sufficiently slowly for All Might to have already overwhelmed Escanor by the time it happens.

      Being 2.32 times stronger doesn't make you harder to cut, like at all. And the wounds he receives will have him screaming in agony.

      Most of Escanor's heat is SUNLIGHT how many times have we had to explain that to you? All Might will not be puncing sunlight away.

      Anyways, I've asked a Discussion Mod to close this thread. As it is concluded

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    • VersusJunkie54 wrote:

      Anyways, I've asked a Discussion Mod to close this thread. As it is concluded

      Thank fuck.

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    • DDM is taking too long. Who is currently online? I'm getting tired of the Escanor downplay and All Might wank

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    • Yeah, it kinda does. If you were to use a 9-C knife against something like wood, you'd meet significant resistance even if that wood is just 9-C+.

      But now you've explained the rest decently. I switch my vote to Escanor, mid-diff.

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      Yeah, it kinda does. If you were to use a 9-C knife against something like wood, you'd meet significant resistance even if that wood is just 9-C+.

      But now you've explained the rest decently. I switch my vote to Escanor, mid-diff.

      Bad comparison. Cutting 9-C+ wood /=/ Cutting 9-C+ flesh.

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    • Why is this still happening?

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    • Because the mod I messaged isn't online it would seem. Can someone call another mod? Before Professor starts going full Argumentium ad Verbosium again?

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    • Hey, before this gets closed down, how close is Escanor to 6-C?

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    • I didn't say it's the same, but it's similar. There are people in real life who stopped knives in their flesh already. Just toning your muscles or contracting them increases their durability to this kind of stuff, and with All Might's physique... I really don't see why he would be unable to tank that just like Escanor can tank cutting attacks and just get chipped a little.

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    • Mand21 wrote:
      I didn't say it's the same, but it's similar. There are people in real life who stopped knives in their flesh already. Just toning your muscles or contracting them increases their durability to this kind of stuff, and with All Might's physique... I really don't see why he would be unable to tank that just like Escanor can tank cutting attacks and just get chipped a little.

      I've never heard about that. If you're only 2.32 times stronger than someone. A very sharp axe with a lot of momentum is going to cut you up pretty badly.

      I'm pretty sure those people you're talking about are monks that have trained for years to condition their body to withstand blades. There is no evidence All Might did the same.

      @Apies. Escanor is baseline. Though I'm gonna see if a calc for him melting that city could yield anything better.

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