Umm yeah, yeah it kinda does. Maybe you didn't realize but Ur being alive as Ice Shell was the our point of contention. Me pointing out other magics that are not alive do matter as what counts as alive was the whole disagreement.
as long as it constitutes to the continuation and/or creation of life then that definitely still applies.
Contributing to the creation/continuation of life does not make something alive. The very much dead fish I just had for dinner contributes to the continuation of my life but that doesn't mean its alive.
Yes Natsu’s Fireis alive
Your previous sentence begs to differ
since all magic is alive being born from it’s source “Love”.
It isn't alive and isn't born from love at all. Are you sure you are still talking about magic?
Life is born of love.
Thats a very idealistic and romantic point of view but no it isn't.
It is no different from celestial spirits
It is very different. Campfire =/= Living person
since they are part of magic as well,
No they aren't. Being a magical being does not make you part of magic.
to not be part of that is something that would be not love
It isn't part of whatever you are spouting and it wouldn't be love anyway. What does love even have to do with anything?
and life would not be born.
Life would still be born regardless of love which, again, has nothing to do with magic or life.
In essence, Iced Shell is not a suicide move,
But it is though
because that would mean killing oneself,
It does as the user no longer fulfils the prerequisites that define being alive
as she becomes the ice itselfand is still alive even to this day as the very essence of the ocean.
Iced Shell turns a users body into ice to seal away a target. They turn into ICE. Don't even bother responding to everything above and answer the question below. It'll save us both some time and tell me what I need to know.
If a rat was transmuted to gold, is it still alive? Please answer 'Yes' or 'No' .
actually, that question is not necessary, because let me share with you one piece of solid evidence that Ur is still alive and that ice is still a living thing, Ur's Arc of Time can effect anything thing that is non organic, move it forward or backwards in time, and She stated it herself that she cannot effect Iced Shell because it is considered Ur
Small correction but it makes a big difference. Arc of Time's limitation is that it doesn't work on creatures with the exception of their Origins, not specifically living things. On Tenroujima she grows a tree in seconds against Natsu and trees are alive.
Also what chapter does she say that? I don't remember it in Galuna or Tenrou but the latter is the part where Arc of Time gets explained. Regardless, Iced Shell is made from the casters body which is that of a creatures hence AoT not working. Its like Gray freezing his blood. Still Ice but still made from a creature.
Correction, that tree was non sentient, it is referring to animal and humans and such. It is when Natsu fought Ultear for the first time.
Also, That does not make any sense, since you claim that ice is just ice and not living being. Then Ultear would’ve just reversed time to the point where Ur was just starting the process to seal Deliora, obviously Iced Shell can be stopped or interrupted mid point so she could do that and free Deliora, Ultear is a clever woman so she would have done that, but obvious she couldn’t because Iced She’ll “is” her mother and thus a living being. Same with Gray’s blood and ice, Gray already created the ice and the blood was just added into it, does not mean that she can’t just reverse or fast forward the ice and let the blood drip. Even Gray Stated that it was a living being his blades. Or even with just blood freezing, she is not technically effecting it, just the freezing process.
Actually if it is just frozen blood then that proves that Iced Shell is a living being and thus not simply ice
It not being sentient is irrelevant. You said it can't affect living things and I gave an example of it working on a living thing.
As in, Natsu vs Uktear on Tenrou or Natsu vs Zalty on Galuna?
I did not claim ice is just ice and it most certainly not living. I am seriously thinking you haven't paid attention to my wording. So far, I have said Arc of Time doesn't work on animal matter, not living matter. That means whether the animal matter is alive or dead, it will be unaffected by Ultear's magic.
Arc of Time specifically works on the target object at hand. Iced Shell can't be undone with AoT because it is made of Ur's corpse. Right now you seem to be arguing two things that run counter to each other.
1. Ultear simply reverse's not the (living) object but the events around it thereby bypassing its restriction on affecting animal matter.
2. Ultear cannot reverse Iced Shell because the ice is alive.
The first is wrong because Arc of Time targets the object, as I said earlier, while the ice can't be alive because it is frozen human cells.
Gray's frozen blood is exactly that, blood that is frozen, not ice with some blood thrown in. It is nothing but frozen animal matter just like Ur's Iced Shell. There is no "ice" (the frozen water variant) in that move since he freezes the blood to bypass her Arc of Time. Frozen cells are dead.
At this point you need to start providing scans for this stuff because he didn't say the blood blades were alive. Either you read bad translations, english isn't your first language (thus all the forms of miscommunication) or you are trolling/lying. I am doubting you are trolling/lying so that leaves the first two because I have never come across what you are saying before.
That right there proves my point that AoT cannot effect animal matter, while Ur is still alive, and stated multiple times in the Galuna Arc. And even in Tenru Arc, Ur is still alive enough to tell her what really happened back then. and even after leaving the body, blood can still be fresh even when frozen for a certain amount of time. Natsu vs Ultear on Galuna.
I would provide scans but official scans are hard to do and can’t really get the post for them.
But you can find the info in chapters 38, 39, 42, 240-241,
This states where Ur is still alive from her and others, and who Ultear cannot effect Iced Shell because it is Ur, and that it cannot effect living beings.
You didn't say it can't affect animal matter, thats what I've been saying. You have been saying it can't affect living matter which I already proved wrong. It says she is alive because people have a problem distinguishing with sentient and alive. Ur isn't alive, she is semi-sentient at best, only being able convey feelings and emotions.
Blood is cooled to slow down its functions to keep it from denaturing and dying. The key word in that sentence was cooled, not frozen. Freezing blood solid like Gray did kills it.
Thats fair. Its honestly a pain trying to get hold of official scans and even then having the raws and someone who knows japanese is almost required since official stuff love their mistranslations.
No, I have been saying living matter in the same sense as in sentient and living. tree does not fall under that former category. No, she is alive, she said she will live eternally, and proved so later on, and you seem to be ignoring that.
What you said, copy 'n pasted from the message you just sent.
"I have been saying living matter"
What I said you said, copy 'n pasted from the previous message I sent.
"You have been saying it can't affect living matter"
Explain where we disagree on what you said. Sentient and living are two different things as I've stated multiple times.
sentient /ˈsɛntɪənt,ˈsɛnʃ(ə)nt/Submit adjective adjective: sentient able to perceive or feel things.
The 7 characteristics of living things that I already told you to look up
responsiveness to the environment;
growth and change;
ability to reproduce;
have a metabolism and breathe;
being made of cells; and.
passing traits onto offspring
Sentience is one of 7 different things that define a living organism. Iced Shell and Gray's frozen blood fail to meet 5 of these. Natsu's flames fail to meet 6 of these. Celestial Spirits meet all of these. You are arguing sentience = life when it doesn't.
Unless you change your mind or can come up with some way for Iced Shell to meet these requirements, this will go nowhere. I am unfollowing now but thanks for the debate nonetheless.
It doesn’t matter, she is stated to be alive and that ice is living matter. I don’t know how hard is that to understand, she never died, just transformed into the ice. If Ultear cannot effect it, then it does meet all the requirements needed, if you insist it is not living matter, then Ultear could have effected Iced Shell and Gray’s blood
so yeah, i was doing some reading and some thinking i remembered that i had seen before. we DO have much slower verses than fairy tail that have LS or higehr listed in their reactions speed, so maybe the calc wasnt fully useless. just wanted to point that out. one of the more well known ones is black clover btw
Theoretically, if you redo the Etherion Magic Confinement calc soon, what do you predict the result to be reasonably, will it give the verse an upgrade, cause we’re kind’ve at the point where if there is gonna be an upgrade, we should do it all at once, especially if Sema is accepted at 7-A